Oil and Gas Barons screwing the UK

[texasboy]

 . Just three companies - BP, Centrica and Shell - together made £1,000 profit every second over the first six months of this year.

"These corporations are robbing from the poor to give to the rich(poor shareholders) and they know it. And it's about time they learned that, in a progressive democracy, there is no place for robber barons."

http://latestnews.virginmedia.com/news/uk/2008/09/06/greens_leader_slams_robber_barons

Rising fuel costs have provided the Government with a windfall of as much as £1 billion from a scheme designed to promote renewable energy, it has been reported.
http://latestnews.virginmedia.com/news/uk/2008/09/06/energy_costs_netted_treasury_1bn?vmsrc=pamread

So we are getting screwed from both sides. As a pensioner if I had to exist on the £109 per week(after paying into the scheme for 50 years) that the Labour government kindly provides ,then I wouldnt be able to afford to turn this PC on. The present Labour government hasnt got the balls to stand up for its own people and keeps adding taxes to hopefully kill off all the old people who now  have a choice this winter. Buy fuel or buy food.
Enough said.
cheers

[Quantum]

It's not the job of the U.K Government to tax British companies for profits their making from non-British ventures, maybe if they made the money of us then I'd agree with it, but it's actually a highly competitive Energy market.

If we start asking companies to subsidies our energy then we're only inviting the big companies to create a monopoly.

[texasboy]

It's not the job of the U.K Government to tax British companies for profits their making from non-British ventures, maybe if they made the money of us then I'd agree with it, but it's actually a highly competitive Energy market.

If we start asking companies to subsidies our energy then we're only inviting the big companies to create a monopoly.

Of course we are not asking for Gas and Oil companies to subsides our energy. and we are not asking the Labour government to tax  companies who are ripping us off. We are asking for a government that  can set prices that the pensioners can provide reasonable heating for their homes in winter,with some left over to provide basic meals.. Some of us ,probably including yourself, have a good family background and not living on £109 per week would not see this as a problem. Check out the post office on pension day or older people round the "reduced" shelves in the supermarket.
Visit another EU country and see the difference they are paying for fuel and gas. I can drive 20 miles to Ireland and get 15-20p per litre off the price of diesel.(even cheaper on continent).  Is our government too greedy with taxes or have they driven themselves into a financial hole. Many of us need a car to reach work where public transit is poor or non existant.(most public transit shuts down at 10.30pm here).
What we now have to pay for fuel and gas is not a true reflection of current prices with a reasonable profit margin. Wish I could afford a few shares ,then I could show the fingers like the rest of them
cheers

[Quantum]

You bring up 2 very separate points there:

1) Poor off families / individuals should not have to pay as much to live in warmth

And I completely agree with this, government needs to subsidies them, but it means tax for the rest of us either way. Either Government raises it through taxes on businesses / income taxes etc.. or we mandate companies to do it and they'll likely raise everyone else's and then be able to use that an excuse if they do overcharge us.

2) The cost of fuel is more in the U.K than anywhere else in Europe

While true, the average cost of driving on the road is very normal compared to the rest of Europe. Just countries like France charge far more on road tax and we don't really have to pay tolls here as well. When we're talking about a more green country, it seems fair that the cost of tax you're paying is proportional to the amount of pollution you're making.

[texasboy]

While somewhat agreed with you Quantum,(who wants to drive in France anyway). We have tolls on our new motorways. Why do you think that truckers fill their tanks outside UK?

There shouldnt be any extra tax on us if we had a government that knew how to manage their budget. Millions allocated to NHS recently and wasted on red tape instead of helping the people. Waiting times for surgery are no better.
At the bottom line we are becoming the most overtaxed nation.
At least some of the Scandanavian countries who deliberately charge higher taxes, provide excellent care for their elder citizens.
Time to get spongers off the benefits. England is set to become one of the highest densely populated countries with not all paying any form of taxes
cheers
Even a rental car in Spain is cheaper than driving in UK

[Quantum]

While somewhat agreed with you Quantum,(who wants to drive in France anyway). We have tolls on our new motorways. Why do you think that truckers fill their tanks outside UK?

There shouldnt be any extra tax on us if we had a government that knew how to manage their budget. Millions allocated to NHS recently and wasted on red tape instead of helping the people. Waiting times for surgery are no better.
At the bottom line we are becoming the most overtaxed nation.
At least some of the Scandanavian countries who deliberately charge higher taxes, provide excellent care for their elder citizens.
Time to get spongers off the benefits. England is set to become one of the highest densely populated countries with not all paying any form of taxes
cheers
Even a rental car in Spain is cheaper than driving in UK

Truckers fill up outside the U.K because France has a different way of charging their motorist, as I just explained. Same goes for spain, if you actually work out the average price of driving a car in Europe, the U.K is pretty average. In fact the cost of running a car and the price of petrol, inflation taken in to account, has actually gone down consistently over the last 30 years.

A government who knew how to manage their budget? Every single government since the war has come to office with the promoise of reducing bureaucracy but EVERY single government increases it, there is a simple reason for this, because it's actually how you get policies implemented for an increasingly demanding affluent nation. Though I would agree, that productivity has not gone up nearly highly enough in the NHS over the last few years, so I do think we should get more bang for our buck in that respect, but I certainly endorse the system we have over something like the American set-up.

[texasboy]

the U.K is pretty average. In fact the cost of running a car and the price of petrol, inflation taken in to account, has actually gone down consistently over the last 30 years.

Quantum, I like a reasonalble debate,but did not expect this from you. If you honestly believe that the UK is not suffering at the moment because of all the taxes that this government has placed on the working class and pensioners,then as I said before your family must be providing you with the essentials of life. Try running a car,buy food,pay for heating and electricity,plus rent or mortgage on your own.!!

“During the past eighteen months the whole of UK industry has experienced increased costs as a consequence of higher oil prices on the world market. At a time when we are suffering from the joint threats of an economic slowdown and increasing inflation, the higher costs of transporting goods and services resulting from price rises for fuel have impacted on every single company throughout the UK, and thus on their customers.

“Clearly the Chancellor can have little or no influence on the world price of oil, although he enjoys unbudgeted income when it rises. However, he is responsible for the greater part of the cost of diesel and petrol which is made up of fuel duty and VAT. These taxes constitute almost two-thirds of pump prices – for every £1.05 per litre the Government collects 66p.

Many fuel retailers are barely clearing costs. There are now less than 9,500 forecourts in the UK, including supermarket filling stations. This is the lowest number of filling stations in the UK since 1912.

At 50.35ppl, UK fuel duty for diesel and petrol is already the highest in Europe. Indeed UK diesel duty is double the EU average rate of 25ppl.


A UK pensioner living in Spain can afford to run a car/buy fuel and still have a healthy eating style.
How can you possible say that we are the same as our neighbours in EU??
cheers

[fuzzytomcat]

Hi guys,

I hate to interject here but until the whole world can get of fossel fuels, the rich get richer and the money goes to places other than our own countries.

But hope is on the horizon and new technologies "are" there, very soon many options will be available for all, here is just "one" example -

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jt5z8L4LBJE&feature=related

This is just the tip of the iceburg ........

( some things are hard to put a tax on )

Best Regards,
Fuzzy
 

[Quantum]

Tex, you're objecting to a statical fact with subjective reasoning. Putting quotes in various colours won't change the fact that it's cheaper to run a car now than it was 30 years ago, inflation taken in to account and if you combine all the costs of running a car we're not at the top of the list for how expensive it is to run a car in Europe.

Of course in the last 18 months prices have gone up, like they have in all countries with similar economies to us. But this country is today more affluent than it has been at any point through history, most families aren't working class, the country tipped to being mostly middle class about 5 years ago.

Clearly the Chancellor can have little or no influence on the world price of oil, although he enjoys unbudgeted income when it rises. However, he is responsible for the greater part of the cost of diesel and petrol which is made up of fuel duty and VAT. These taxes constitute almost two-thirds of pump prices – for every £1.05 per litre the Government collects 66p.

You can quote the exact statistics of fuel tax to me as much as you want, but it still doesn't change the fact that long with running a car, fuel is actually cheaper than it was 30 years ago, inflation taken in to account.

The reason people are struggling with bills is a lot people were out-living means, buying houses they couldn't possibly afford and it's having a knock on effect at the economy as a whole. Being reactionary and reducing taxes to artificially try and boost confidence in the market will have little to no effect, as we've seen in the American market.

Many fuel retailers are barely clearing costs. There are now less than 9,500 forecourts in the UK, including supermarket filling stations. This is the lowest number of filling stations in the UK since 1912.

So? Can you actually show me that that means anything at all?

"A UK pensioner living in Spain can afford to run a car/buy fuel and still have a healthy eating style.
How can you possible say that we are the same as our neighbours in EU??"

I didn't say that, please don't misquote me. Maybe it is cheaper to run a car in Spain, that doesn't stop what I said being untrue.

[billyfridge]

He he he...Quantum...I see yer still as sharp as ever!!!!!!

As a pensioner myself, and having dealt with pensioners for over 30yrs (going into their homes, and repairing their appliances) i found that very few, if any, are poor. The picture of a pensioner huddled over a tiny fire, having a frugal meal, is a picture they want to portray.
As for high fuel costs, I don't like them anymore than you, the fact the fuel company's are making millions profit is something I can not remark about because that is way above my understanding. I just assume that the more profit they make, the more taxes they pay, and so help towards my pension. what happened to North Sea gas Quantum???...did it run out?
I have noticed with my own married children, that they both have to work to make ends meet. Running two cars, family meals at McDonalds, motrgage payments, bottles of wine, designer clothes for them, and their children, holidays in Cuba, all cost money.
My 5 children had to wear hand me downs when they were growing up, and their mother had to walk them to school, and collect them at home time.

[Quantum]

Yes, North Sea gas is running out, we used it up, that's what happens with fossil fuel sources. If we'd try to sell the gas at the best prices over time to other countries and put up with normal prices like the rest of the world we'd be used to normal prices and we'd of been able to spend all that money on infrastructure. Whether it be transport to better connect people and promote business, or health to better ensure well being and promote a healthy society. Unfortunately very few governments think like that, left or right, they just look it as a way to ease the mind of the voter from their next bill.

But Billy, where did you drop your rosy tinted glasses  ? 


P.S Tex, I'm not actually arguing for arguments sake, strange as it is, this is my opinion. Awfully capitalistic as it sounds, I do think markets work some times and we should certainly be taxing profits they register here.

[billyfridge]

But Billy, where did you drop your rosy tinted glasses  ? 

In Piccadilly Gardens M/c.....when I realised the world had moved on

[texasboy]

  Will you lot stop picking on me.lol
Billy= rich pensioner.
Quantum= family supported.

Seriously, we are probably very lucky that we can make ends meet.
http://latestnews.virginmedia.com/news/uk/2008/09/08/warning_over_growing_fuel_poverty?vmsrc=pamread

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/pressass/20080908/tuk-charity-pensioners-face-rationing-6323e80.html

This is not considering new families from abroad that walk into houses,council,or privately rented by Social Services. Rent paid, full benefits,money for furniture,heating etc.

There are several million people out there that cannot realistically survive on a state pension.

Prices in NI are much higher than the rest of UK. Loaf of cheap bread 89p, most plain loaves  £1.15 to £1.45. Our electric and gas is 10% higher. Yet we only get the same pension.
I personally could nt exist on £109pw.
cheers

 

[billyfridge]

Will you lot stop picking on me.lol
Billy= rich pensioner.
Quantum= family supported.

Seriously, we are probably very lucky that we can make ends meet.
http://latestnews.virginmedia.com/news/uk/2008/09/08/warning_over_growing_fuel_poverty?vmsrc=pamread

http://uk.news.yahoo.com/pressass/20080908/tuk-charity-pensioners-face-rationing-6323e80.html

This is not considering new families from abroad that walk into houses,council,or privately rented by Social Services. Rent paid, full benefits,money for furniture,heating etc.

There are several million people out there that cannot realistically survive on a state pension.

Prices in NI are much higher than the rest of UK. Loaf of cheap bread 89p, most plain loaves  £1.15 to £1.45. Our electric and gas is 10% higher. Yet we only get the same pension.
I personally could nt exist on £109pw.
cheers

 

Put yer fiddle away tex....you will have to cut down on the Jack Daniels is all 

[boun]

grea i love it